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welcome to the skeptic zone the podcast

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from Australia for science and reason

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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[Music]

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yes it's the skeptic zone podcast

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episode number 572 for the 29th of

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September 2019 Richard Saunders here

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with you from Sydney Australia coming up

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on this week's show no aliens were set

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free at area 51 what a shock you may

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have heard that people did gather at

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area 51 and the surrounding locations

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for this storm area 51 event which sort

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of sort of sort of happened a bit a

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little bit around the fringes there sort

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of didn't see any released aliens but

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never mind we're going to chat to Ben

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Radford about the fast Fiasco flop that

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was storm area 51 coming up at the top

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of the show as poor aliens we'll just

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have to wait for another another time

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after that we talked about the Wallaby

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award now coming up this year at the

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Australian skeptics National Convention

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and I hope to see you there will be the

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awarding of the Wallaby award or the

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Barry Williams award for skeptical

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journalism there is a cash prize

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attached to this award if you are a

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journalist or you know a journalist in

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Australia you may be very interested in

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this award and keep listening to find

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out how to apply after that we have the

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raw skeptic Heidi Robinson talking about

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a horse chiropractor and not only that

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it's a double whammy it's a chiropractor

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who uses homeopathy on horses it boggles

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the mind folks it boggles the mind find

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out more with Heidi Robinson then to

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round off the show we have from the

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pages of the skeptic the journal from

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Australian skeptics not to be confused

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with any other magazine around the world

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will word skeptic in it an article

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called did we say that creationists

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farewell some old friends that

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particularly interesting report article

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about the way that creationists

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have quietly let go of some of their

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strongest arguments which weren't that

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strong in the first place I guess now if

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you're in Sydney on October 3rd a the

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3rd of October coming up very soon

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come to skeptics in the pub Australian

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skeptics skeptics in the pub at the

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Occidental hotel which is in York Street

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Sydney just near whinnied train station

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and the presentation will be by none

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other than Trish Hann who does the Trish

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and chip segment on the sceptic zone

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from time to time and her talk is time

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equals brain a new dawn in stroke

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treatment

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Trish Hann committee member of the

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Australian skeptics Inc will talk about

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the latest methods and discoveries in

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the treatment of strokes Trish is a

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radiographer at the Royal Prince Alfred

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Hospital and is currently involved in

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clinical trials in this area and of

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course Sydney skeptics in the pub is

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normally the first Thursday of the month

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from 6:00 p.m. at the Occidental hotel

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and if you can make it along that would

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be great come up and say hello more

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information look for the link in this

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week's show notes now October the 1st

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Tuesday October the 1st

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Maynard's movie night flying high and

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this will be at the red bar which is

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upstairs at 36 Lee Point Road in glebe

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from 7 p.m. and that's not far from the

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Broadway for those people in Sydney

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tickets are only $10 link in this week's

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show notes or just go to tinyurl.com /

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fh maynard flying high with me nod hope

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to see you there well that's all from me

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at the moment it's time for me to run

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downstairs

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why not have a traditional breakfast of

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Vegemite toast why not followed by

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coffee or maybe some coffee first well I

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do that I hope you enjoy the skeptic

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zone

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[Music]

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[Applause]

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joining me now all the way from

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beautiful and I mean this folks cuz I've

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been there

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Albuquerque New Mexico it's my old

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friend Ben Radford hello Ben

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hello there Richard hello now I don't

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think I don't think you made the effort

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to go to area 51 but some people did can

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you give our listeners a quick update on

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that bizarre situation with the B Fiasco

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yes I know wherever you speak I have

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been to area 51 it was several years ago

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and I certainly didn't didn't do it for

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part of the recent storm area 51

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movement which because I'm sensible nor

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did I show up for the the the later

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alien stock which became a fiasco but

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yes so as just to just to just to remind

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people what happened so there was a June

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27th Facebook basically joke titled

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storm area 51 so this this this guy on

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Facebook I decided that he wanted to you

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know hey they can't stop all of us let's

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all run towards area 51 the the military

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base and see what happens this was of

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course a bad idea and soon he admitted

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no it was all a joke I didn't really

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mean it

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the military was not not impressed by

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this idea so then it sort of became

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transformed into so a few weeks after

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that someone said okay well we already

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have all this interest in it people

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already talking about the area 51 thing

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let's have a festival let's have a lien

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stock so that was supposed to happen in

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the small town of Rachel and by a small

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town I mean tiny town with the

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population of like under a hundred or so

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Wow

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yeah a small little place there this

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fiasco this disaster

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waiting to happen so the thought was

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well can we have all this interest in it

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why don't we you know we're gonna have a

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band and we're gonna have music and

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there'll be art and this this hole is

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supposed to be this whole production

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meanwhile the town of Rachel and its

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inhabitants were very worried about this

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because there's no infrastructure out

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there at all there's one small one small

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place a little restaurant places as I

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think ten rooms a bit of an inn there

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but basically there's there's nothing

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out there there's nothing there's no way

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to feed or clothe their house that many

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people so that that also imploded quite

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spectacularly actually apparently

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allegedly their lawsuits come forth

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doing oh no the the the people of the

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town of Rachel and the the initial

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initial people who were selling tickets

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for food trucks and things like that so

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that all didn't happen and then sort of

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this is sort of the the Plan C or D is

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this point they eventually moved a part

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of it to Las Vegas where there's lots of

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infrastructure in Vegas there's uh

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showgirls there's magicians

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there's hotels food shelter things like

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that and apparently there was a a much

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much smaller festival there this past

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week so I think I think it drew maybe a

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couple thousand people but it was

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nothing like what was originally planned

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well I'm just having a quick look now

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because there are photographs online

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folks of the alien stock and there's a

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little stage a couple of people dancing

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I look at some other photographs some

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people actually went to the trouble to

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dress up as well aliens or in spacesuits

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or something like that I guess and

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somebody said they went along just to

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take the selfies sure and you know and

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you know on some level why wouldn't you

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right I mean people love aliens they

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love UFOs you know the the Roswell

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festival held here in New Mexico and

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Roswell every year is a testament to

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that so people love to dress up they

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love to

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do something fun and you know put on

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alien stuff so of course they're gonna

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pull this stuff out of their closets or

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it's possible the course some people you

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know just like that every day yeah

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possibly possibly so but that's so that

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was the the I of people having a bit of

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fun you know a dance with aliens and

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whatever I mean why not sounds like fun

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indeed but this whole idea about

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storming area51 I think that was even a

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bigger flop wasn't it yes

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you know because keep in mind that area

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51 it's it is a it's a military base and

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it's it's a military installation and

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they do various things there including

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testing an aircraft and and and things

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like that in some cases maybe munitions

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um and it is a restricted place whether

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whether whether or not they have alien

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bodies and crash saucer is an entirely

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different question but but yeah so the

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the military of course had to take some

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of the seriously I mean the the military

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and the Pentagon you know they do have

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people that read social media hopefully

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they're they're not just you know

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building building a military

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infrastructure they have people that are

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paying attention to this and it came to

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their attention that you know this guy's

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has this strongly or 51 thing and the

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military and the base there needed to be

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aware of that and so they they issued a

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statement that was I would say polite

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but from yeah saying do not storm area

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51 Lethal lethal for that lethal force

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is authorized and same thing with any

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military base so and I guarantee you

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that if you if you try to store a

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military base in say Russia or France

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well yes or or England that won't go

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well either not generally speaking not a

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very good idea but I also noticed from

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the headlines that not much happen but

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two people were arrested for doing silly

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things yes apparently there were a

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couple alcohol-fueled arrests which is

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sort of a slow day around here

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Rachel but I mean that's that's the

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that's that's pretty low low low turnout

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and apparently I heard that some some

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sex workers up in that part of Nevada

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where prostitution is legal uh-huh they

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were apparently hoping for a dramatic

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increase in clients though that sadly

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for them did not materialize this story

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just gets stranger and stranger baby oh

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well look there we are folks there's a

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quick wrap up from bed radford the idea

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is if you want to go to area 51 for a

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bit of fun wear a funny costume and

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dance with aliens why not I mean if he

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can get away with it take your own

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Caravan I would suggest but the idea of

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trying to storm the military base to

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look for probably non-existent aliens is

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not one of the best ideas ever conceived

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exactly exactly

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well better how can people catch up with

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what you're up to well people of course

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can find me on my podcast squaring the

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strange we recently celebrated our 100th

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one hundred and first actually episode

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so that's kind of a it's that's right

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yeah I'm around and about I recently on

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a show a TV show with Josh gates called

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Expedition unknown which crinel

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chronicled our our investigation in

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Puerto Rico into the chupacabra all

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right my favorite monster yeah great

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okay folks lots of opportunities I'll

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link to you been in this week's show

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notes but for now until the next time we

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contemplate storming area 51 Ben Radford

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thank you very much thanks

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[Applause]

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hey fellow skeptics in Medford here with

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Celeste reward your friendly host of

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starting the strange a podcast that

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looks at topics ranging from legends

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panics and cryptids debating myths

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psychology and folklore breaking things

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down and picking things apart as we

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skeptics do we bring a few different

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perspectives on things pleasure for

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example is a witty cartoonist and Ben is

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a brilliant writer and longtime

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skeptical investigator we don't always

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agree well we have fun trying and we

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learn new things join us for new topics

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every week or two or browse our backlog

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of evergreen episodes available on

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iTunes and all your podcast feeding

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troughs squaring the strange take care

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[Music]

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now here's an announcement from the

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Australian skeptics at skeptics common

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today you Australian skeptics calls for

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nominations for media prize by Tim

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Mendham published on the 26th of

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September Australian skeptics in tears

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once again offering an annual award for

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the best piece of skeptical journalism

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the Barry Williams award for skeptical

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journalism recognizes the best piece of

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journalism in any medium that takes a

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critical and skeptical approach to

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topics that fall within our remit which

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is the scientific investigation of

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pseudoscience and the paranormal it is

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awarded annually with a citation and a

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two thousand dollar prize the first

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00:15:05,369 --> 00:15:02,829
award was given in 2018 to news limited

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journalist Jane Hansen for a series of

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pieces on the anti-vaccination movement

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and the no jab no paid slash play

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legislation a panel made up of

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experienced award-winning journalists

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across differing media has been put

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together to review entries the award is

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named for the late William past

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president and executive officer of

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Australian skeptics Inc who was a

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regular on the Australian media the

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award is nicknamed the wallaby in memory

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of Sir Jim our wallaby the regular ngon

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de plume Barry used for his more

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whimsical editorial pieces

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Tim Mendham executive officer of

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Australian skeptics Inc and the editor

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of the journal the skeptic said quote we

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are calling for nominations for the 2019

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wallaby from skeptics the public and the

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media journalists can nominate their own

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work it would normally be given for one

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piece or a series used in print TV radio

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or online produced in Australia and

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quote the item or items nominated should

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have been published between November

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00:16:22,199 --> 00:16:20,769
2018 and October 2019 inclusive

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00:16:24,710 --> 00:16:22,209
nominations should be

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00:16:29,579 --> 00:16:24,720
sent to the editor of the skeptic at

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editor at skeptics comdata you or send

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hard copies to Australian skeptics Pio

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box 20 Beecroft New South Wales 2 1 1 9

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00:16:42,710 --> 00:16:40,300
deadline is November the 1st 2019

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Tim Mendham said that the key issue

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would be the nature of a sceptical piece

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of journalism quote should it take a

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debunking stance or more general

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00:16:57,840 --> 00:16:55,509
critical thinking approach personally I

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would prefer the second the piece takes

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a critical investigative approach on the

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topic though I must admit I might have

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concerns if a piece came down in favor

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00:17:13,110 --> 00:17:11,350
of the outer fringes of woo my view is

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that we should certainly not be

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rewarding a puff piece for either side

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00:17:22,980 --> 00:17:19,870
of the argument serious journalism only

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need apply end quote the Wallaby will

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00:17:27,720 --> 00:17:24,939
complement the skeptics other Awards

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00:17:29,700 --> 00:17:27,730
which include the bench spoon which goes

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00:17:31,740 --> 00:17:29,710
to the perpetrator of the most

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00:17:34,680 --> 00:17:31,750
preposterous piece of paranormal piffle

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00:17:37,320 --> 00:17:34,690
as well as the more positive skeptic of

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00:17:39,630 --> 00:17:37,330
the year and the thorny reward for the

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00:17:41,490 --> 00:17:39,640
promotion of Reason the latter goes to a

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00:17:43,260 --> 00:17:41,500
member of the public who might not have

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00:17:45,870 --> 00:17:43,270
anything to do with the skeptical

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00:17:48,210 --> 00:17:45,880
movement both the wallaby and the Thor

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00:17:50,940 --> 00:17:48,220
net Awards include a two thousand dollar

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00:17:52,710 --> 00:17:50,950
prize the recipients of these awards are

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00:17:56,220 --> 00:17:52,720
traditionally announced at the gala

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00:17:59,070 --> 00:17:56,230
dinner at skeptic on the skeptics annual

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00:18:03,890 --> 00:17:59,080
National Convention which this year will

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00:18:09,360 --> 00:18:06,690
more details can be found by going to

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00:18:11,740 --> 00:18:09,370
skeptics comm today you or following the

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00:18:31,910 --> 00:18:11,750
link on this week's show notes

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00:18:36,910 --> 00:18:33,270
[Music]

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olice masala Paola the delay Moses with

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other Buenos Aires in Argentina when the

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Kucha most podcasts Kucha mom I'm ok

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Kucha todo el mundo como the skeptics

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00:18:49,540 --> 00:18:46,850
own ojala pueden madeira visit Ana's

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algun dia esperamos con nuestra rikishi

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00:18:59,350 --> 00:18:52,160
Mikami de-localized yeah podemos hablar

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00:19:01,540 --> 00:18:59,360
un tango mientras tanto sugandha Rotondo

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00:19:01,990 --> 00:19:01,550
de su dosa same analogy NCI pensamiento

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00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:02,000
racional

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00:19:31,919 --> 00:19:22,169
it's the raw skeptic report with Heidi

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00:19:34,169 --> 00:19:31,929
Robertson hello everyone Heidi Robertson

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00:19:39,060 --> 00:19:34,179
from the Northern Rivers vaccination

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00:19:42,539 --> 00:19:39,070
supporters this week a story hit the

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00:19:46,669 --> 00:19:42,549
news online it was all over the internet

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00:19:50,070 --> 00:19:46,679
in various different publications and I

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00:19:52,529 --> 00:19:50,080
I got nothing I'm just going to read it

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00:19:58,099 --> 00:19:52,539
out and you can see for yourself

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00:20:02,849 --> 00:19:58,109
here we go September the 19th 2019

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00:20:05,909 --> 00:20:02,859
Queensland HeLa sold water as Hendra

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00:20:10,909 --> 00:20:05,919
vaccine in the Canberra Times calmed a

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00:20:13,499 --> 00:20:10,919
you by Warren Barnsley a Queensland

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00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:13,509
chiropractor turned alternative healer

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00:20:18,570 --> 00:20:16,690
sold bottled water as a vaccine for the

405
00:20:22,169 --> 00:20:18,580
deadly Hendra virus

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00:20:24,749 --> 00:20:22,179
Peter Lindsay as Dale also claimed the

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00:20:27,299 --> 00:20:24,759
water could treat chickenpox and German

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00:20:29,599 --> 00:20:27,309
measles while another product he

409
00:20:32,489 --> 00:20:29,609
promoted could relieve snakebites

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00:20:36,419 --> 00:20:32,499
herbicide and pesticide poisoning and

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00:20:39,210 --> 00:20:36,429
paralysis ticks as Dale who worked as an

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00:20:43,019 --> 00:20:39,220
equine chiropractor in Warwick east of

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00:20:47,580 --> 00:20:43,029
Brisbane relabeled the water by hand and

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00:20:52,619 --> 00:20:47,590
sold it for $35 a bottle to a buyer in

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00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:52,629
January 2013 a number he wrote on the

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00:20:59,669 --> 00:20:55,450
bottle was said to be a potency rating

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00:21:02,759 --> 00:20:59,679
and just as an aside here I did read

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00:21:05,940 --> 00:21:02,769
another article where he was quoted as

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00:21:10,969 --> 00:21:05,950
saying that the mere act of him writing

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00:21:14,099 --> 00:21:10,979
the potency rating which was 200 CE

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00:21:18,570 --> 00:21:14,109
meant that the bottled water was

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00:21:22,049 --> 00:21:18,580
automatically infused by these with

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00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:22,059
these magical qualities so there you go

424
00:21:28,620 --> 00:21:23,850
just keep that in mind

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00:21:30,539 --> 00:21:28,630
hmm and we go on he marketed it as safe

426
00:21:33,090 --> 00:21:30,549
and effective and better than the

427
00:21:37,110 --> 00:21:33,100
recommended Hendra virus vaccine because

428
00:21:38,789 --> 00:21:37,120
it was non-toxic quote doesn't matter

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00:21:40,769 --> 00:21:38,799
whether you give it to a horse or

430
00:21:43,919 --> 00:21:40,779
yourself that should give you the

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00:21:47,610 --> 00:21:43,929
protection you need and quote he said in

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00:21:51,539 --> 00:21:47,620
a video on his equine energy website in

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00:21:53,730 --> 00:21:51,549
mid 2015 as Dale came under the

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00:21:56,639 --> 00:21:53,740
microscope of health authorities in late

435
00:21:58,919 --> 00:21:56,649
2015 after calling himself a

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00:22:00,899 --> 00:21:58,929
chiropractor despite surrendering his

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00:22:04,649 --> 00:22:00,909
registration to practice in the field

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00:22:06,299 --> 00:22:04,659
several months earlier he later admitted

439
00:22:08,490 --> 00:22:06,309
that there was nothing in the product

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00:22:11,610 --> 00:22:08,500
apart from water and it had not been

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00:22:14,070 --> 00:22:11,620
clinically tested the only evidence he

442
00:22:15,149 --> 00:22:14,080
gave of his of its effectiveness was his

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00:22:18,480 --> 00:22:15,159
own word

444
00:22:20,970 --> 00:22:18,490
in his defense he said claims the water

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00:22:23,370 --> 00:22:20,980
was ineffective were unproven by any

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00:22:27,029 --> 00:22:23,380
Authority with expertise in energy

447
00:22:29,730 --> 00:22:27,039
health care so quote I propose that the

448
00:22:32,820 --> 00:22:29,740
argument is totally invalid until we are

449
00:22:36,299 --> 00:22:32,830
able to demonstrate my claims and quote

450
00:22:38,639 --> 00:22:36,309
as Dale poses serious risk as a health

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00:22:40,850 --> 00:22:38,649
practitioner because of his false claims

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00:22:45,360 --> 00:22:40,860
the Queensland Civil and Administrative

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00:22:47,220 --> 00:22:45,370
Tribunal ruled this week quote these

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00:22:49,769 --> 00:22:47,230
claims put the public at risk from

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00:22:52,680 --> 00:22:49,779
unvaccinated horses who may contract the

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00:22:55,230 --> 00:22:52,690
virus upon their owners reliance on mr.

457
00:22:57,870 --> 00:22:55,240
s Dale's alternative product end quote

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00:23:00,930 --> 00:22:57,880
judge Suzanne Sheridan said in her

459
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:00,940
judgement s Dale has been prohibited

460
00:23:07,590 --> 00:23:04,690
from advertising promoting and supplying

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00:23:11,990 --> 00:23:07,600
any remedy vaccine or treatment not

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00:23:17,039 --> 00:23:12,000
endorsed by science-based medicine and

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00:23:19,259 --> 00:23:17,049
that's the end of that article I don't

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00:23:21,870 --> 00:23:19,269
know what you think but one of my first

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00:23:24,330 --> 00:23:21,880
thoughts on reading it was well why

466
00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:24,340
can't we now go after the other

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00:23:29,879 --> 00:23:27,130
homeopaths who are selling homeo

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00:23:33,659 --> 00:23:29,889
prophylaxis to parents for their

469
00:23:36,539 --> 00:23:33,669
children to supposedly protect them

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00:23:39,480 --> 00:23:36,549
against all of these infectious diseases

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00:23:41,399 --> 00:23:39,490
this is quite a common practice in the

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00:23:43,590 --> 00:23:41,409
region I live in northern New South

473
00:23:46,049 --> 00:23:43,600
Wales it happens under the counter we

474
00:23:47,370 --> 00:23:46,059
know that it happens it's not advertised

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00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:47,380
because they're not allowed to advertise

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00:23:54,690 --> 00:23:52,770
it but we do know that it happens and

477
00:23:58,080 --> 00:23:54,700
parents are therefore giving their

478
00:24:00,750 --> 00:23:58,090
children essentially a bottled water or

479
00:24:03,149 --> 00:24:00,760
sugar pills with no active ingredients -

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00:24:06,090 --> 00:24:03,159
in the belief that it is protecting them

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00:24:10,010 --> 00:24:06,100
against serious infectious disease

482
00:24:14,460 --> 00:24:10,020
now this Peter as Dale has just been

483
00:24:16,770 --> 00:24:14,470
found to be a risk to the public why

484
00:24:20,250 --> 00:24:16,780
can't we do the same with the homeopaths

485
00:24:23,430 --> 00:24:20,260
that are distributing homeo prophylaxis

486
00:24:25,440 --> 00:24:23,440
now I know the homeopaths will just come

487
00:24:28,980 --> 00:24:25,450
back and say well mine's not bottled

488
00:24:34,370 --> 00:24:28,990
water mine has been whatever banged

489
00:24:37,590 --> 00:24:34,380
against a Bible 200 times and diluted 50

490
00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:37,600
gazillion times and still retains the

491
00:24:44,850 --> 00:24:40,450
memory of the original ingredient and

492
00:24:46,710 --> 00:24:44,860
therefore works but I mean really if it

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00:24:49,140 --> 00:24:46,720
were to be lab tested and found that

494
00:24:53,010 --> 00:24:49,150
there was no active ingredient in it how

495
00:24:54,539 --> 00:24:53,020
is that different to this case obviously

496
00:24:56,340 --> 00:24:54,549
I'm not a lawyer there might be

497
00:25:00,270 --> 00:24:56,350
something very obvious that I'm missing

498
00:25:01,980 --> 00:25:00,280
here but it was just interesting to me

499
00:25:04,740 --> 00:25:01,990
that was then that was one of the first

500
00:25:06,330 --> 00:25:04,750
things that popped into my head anyway

501
00:25:09,060 --> 00:25:06,340
that's all I've got for you this week

502
00:25:11,820 --> 00:25:09,070
it's probably more than enough thanks

503
00:25:14,100 --> 00:25:11,830
for listening and until next time this

504
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:14,110
has been Heidi Robertson from the

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00:25:19,799 --> 00:25:16,570
Northern Rivers vaccination supporters

506
00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:19,809
and as usual you can find us on Facebook

507
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:21,490
at Northern Rivers vaccinations

508
00:25:29,430 --> 00:25:24,690
supporters give us a like there and

509
00:25:31,430 --> 00:25:29,440
we're also on Twitter in VAX that's Dax

510
00:25:48,020 --> 00:25:31,440
supporters on

511
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:48,030
okay till next time bye-bye skeptic on

512
00:25:52,890 --> 00:25:50,770
2019 the Australian skeptics National

513
00:25:58,440 --> 00:25:52,900
Convention will be in Melbourne from the

514
00:26:00,720 --> 00:25:58,450
6th to the 8th of December we have an

515
00:26:03,750 --> 00:26:00,730
impressive speaker line-up including the

516
00:26:07,290 --> 00:26:03,760
skeptics guide to the universe dr. Steve

517
00:26:10,890 --> 00:26:07,300
novella Jay novella Cara Santa Maria Bob

518
00:26:12,980 --> 00:26:10,900
novella and Evan Bernstein also susan

519
00:26:15,990 --> 00:26:12,990
gerbic from guerrilla skepticism on

520
00:26:19,410 --> 00:26:16,000
wikipedia and many other international

521
00:26:22,980 --> 00:26:19,420
and local guests including Joe Thorley

522
00:26:26,990 --> 00:26:22,990
the host of zealot a podcast about cults

523
00:26:29,640 --> 00:26:27,000
and an author of a book by the same name

524
00:26:32,190 --> 00:26:29,650
skeptic God includes a trivia night on

525
00:26:36,420 --> 00:26:32,200
Thursday the 5th of December to test

526
00:26:38,490 --> 00:26:36,430
your skeptical knowledge for more

527
00:26:40,970 --> 00:26:38,500
information about the event the speakers

528
00:26:44,850 --> 00:26:40,980
and how to buy tickets visit skeptic

529
00:26:46,220 --> 00:26:44,860
on.org dot a you or follow the link in

530
00:26:59,310 --> 00:26:46,230
this week's show notes

531
00:27:10,130 --> 00:26:59,320
[Music]

532
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:10,140
now it's time to dive once again into

533
00:27:13,460 --> 00:27:11,850
the pages of the skeptic the journal

534
00:27:16,910 --> 00:27:13,470
from Australian skeptics and cover a

535
00:27:20,090 --> 00:27:16,920
topic we hardly ever mention any more on

536
00:27:21,940 --> 00:27:20,100
the skeptic zone one of those golden

537
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:21,950
oldies from the past it's still around

538
00:27:28,490 --> 00:27:25,850
still around but in Australia it's

539
00:27:30,549 --> 00:27:28,500
really been pushed to the background and

540
00:27:33,260 --> 00:27:30,559
certainly on the back burner of

541
00:27:36,350 --> 00:27:33,270
skepticism that is the topic of

542
00:27:38,289 --> 00:27:36,360
creationism and in the early days of

543
00:27:42,049 --> 00:27:38,299
Australian skeptics it was a huge

544
00:27:44,060 --> 00:27:42,059
concern and many skeptics fought long

545
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:44,070
and hard to curb the influence that

546
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:46,490
creationists had on the education system

547
00:28:00,890 --> 00:27:54,290
so we go back to volume 23 number 1 from

548
00:28:05,180 --> 00:28:00,900
2003 on page 11 the story the report did

549
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:05,190
we say that creationists Farewell some

550
00:28:11,460 --> 00:28:08,610
old friends by Brian Baxter

551
00:28:15,340 --> 00:28:11,470
[Music]

552
00:28:17,920 --> 00:28:15,350
push Dogma masquerading a science and

553
00:28:23,710 --> 00:28:17,930
you run the risk of looking ridiculous

554
00:28:26,260 --> 00:28:23,720
a cautionary tale imagine for a moment

555
00:28:29,620 --> 00:28:26,270
that you were the possessor of an

556
00:28:31,990 --> 00:28:29,630
infallible science textbook imagine

557
00:28:34,090 --> 00:28:32,000
though that you could contact the

558
00:28:37,150 --> 00:28:34,100
infallible author of this textbook at

559
00:28:40,030 --> 00:28:37,160
any time and receive guidance as to the

560
00:28:42,100 --> 00:28:40,040
book's correct interpretation with the

561
00:28:44,590 --> 00:28:42,110
system like this in place you'd be

562
00:28:46,780 --> 00:28:44,600
pretty right wouldn't you I mean you

563
00:28:49,240 --> 00:28:46,790
wouldn't keep putting your foot in it

564
00:28:52,440 --> 00:28:49,250
blundering along all over the place and

565
00:28:55,690 --> 00:28:52,450
having to post long lists of your

566
00:29:00,030 --> 00:28:55,700
egregious errors on your internet site

567
00:29:02,290 --> 00:29:00,040
now would you answers in genesis AIG

568
00:29:05,590 --> 00:29:02,300
Australia's major creationist

569
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:05,600
organization has such a textbook it's

570
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:08,450
called the Bible and its omniscient and

571
00:29:16,210 --> 00:29:12,410
author is readily contactable through

572
00:29:19,690 --> 00:29:16,220
the medium of prayer now everyone knows

573
00:29:24,700 --> 00:29:19,700
that God wouldn't steer you wrong so why

574
00:29:27,430 --> 00:29:24,710
does AIG need a webpage like WWE Answers

575
00:29:34,600 --> 00:29:27,440
in Genesis org slash home slash area /

576
00:29:37,900 --> 00:29:34,610
FAQ / don't underst is Don ASP this page

577
00:29:41,250 --> 00:29:37,910
contains an ever-expanding list of

578
00:29:44,830 --> 00:29:41,260
creationist arguments which AIG feels of

579
00:29:47,470 --> 00:29:44,840
past they used by date these are divided

580
00:29:50,620 --> 00:29:47,480
into arguments which should definitely

581
00:29:55,540 --> 00:29:50,630
not be used twenty-six of these as of

582
00:29:59,920 --> 00:29:55,550
February 2003 and a further 10 arguments

583
00:30:02,830 --> 00:29:59,930
which are doubtful hence in advisable to

584
00:30:05,650 --> 00:30:02,840
use AIG you seem to think that its

585
00:30:08,740 --> 00:30:05,660
credentials as a respectable scientific

586
00:30:13,260 --> 00:30:08,750
research body are significantly improved

587
00:30:16,510 --> 00:30:13,270
by the admissions of past era after all

588
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:16,520
evolutionists continually revise their

589
00:30:21,940 --> 00:30:19,250
theories because of new data so it

590
00:30:23,980 --> 00:30:21,950
should not be surprising or distressing

591
00:30:26,290 --> 00:30:23,990
that some creationist

592
00:30:29,919 --> 00:30:26,300
scientific theories need to be revised

593
00:30:32,140 --> 00:30:29,929
to barley Charlie there is no comparison

594
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:32,150
between the constant refining of

595
00:30:38,049 --> 00:30:34,850
established scientific theories and AI

596
00:30:41,919 --> 00:30:38,059
G's devastating attack on its own past

597
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:41,929
as will be seen science may be pruning

598
00:30:49,950 --> 00:30:45,650
the roses but AIG is taking a chainsaw

599
00:30:53,590 --> 00:30:49,960
to its whole garden with our list of ex

600
00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:53,600
arguments in hand let us revisit some

601
00:30:59,770 --> 00:30:55,970
creationist publications and conferences

602
00:31:05,950 --> 00:30:59,780
of earlier times and see if anything has

603
00:31:07,220 --> 00:31:05,960
been left standing the rise and fall of

604
00:31:09,720 --> 00:31:07,230
moon dust

605
00:31:14,110 --> 00:31:09,730
[Music]

606
00:31:19,480 --> 00:31:14,120
until 1997 AIG was known as the creation

607
00:31:23,799 --> 00:31:19,490
Science Foundation C SF and its flagship

608
00:31:27,370 --> 00:31:23,809
magazine was called X Nilo now entitled

609
00:31:31,120 --> 00:31:27,380
creation if we look through X Nilo of

610
00:31:34,060 --> 00:31:31,130
February 1984 and chop out the bits

611
00:31:36,759 --> 00:31:34,070
dependent on abandoned arguments this

612
00:31:40,060 --> 00:31:36,769
August journal looks like the puppies

613
00:31:42,580 --> 00:31:40,070
have been added out goes the Ordovician

614
00:31:45,490 --> 00:31:42,590
Hammer report including a photograph of

615
00:31:45,930 --> 00:31:45,500
the hammer found in 400 million year old

616
00:31:48,570 --> 00:31:45,940
rock

617
00:31:52,980 --> 00:31:48,580
according to AIG s current thinking

618
00:31:56,139 --> 00:31:52,990
items such as gold chains found in coal

619
00:31:59,830 --> 00:31:56,149
henceforth to be treated with reserve

620
00:32:02,619 --> 00:31:59,840
bordering on disdain moon dust also got

621
00:32:05,289 --> 00:32:02,629
a run in this issue although AIG was

622
00:32:08,499 --> 00:32:05,299
already beginning to back away from this

623
00:32:11,560 --> 00:32:08,509
argument its current position is that

624
00:32:14,980 --> 00:32:11,570
for a long time creationists claim that

625
00:32:17,499 --> 00:32:14,990
the dust layer on the moon was too thin

626
00:32:18,820 --> 00:32:17,509
if the dust had truly been falling on it

627
00:32:22,450 --> 00:32:18,830
for billions of years

628
00:32:25,810 --> 00:32:22,460
but early estimates of dust thickness

629
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:25,820
who were wrong so the dust layer

630
00:32:30,210 --> 00:32:28,610
thickness can't be used as proof of a

631
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:30,220
young moon

632
00:32:36,930 --> 00:32:32,130
[Music]

633
00:32:42,169 --> 00:32:40,229
all references to original scientific

634
00:32:44,849 --> 00:32:42,179
research in Paluxy River in Texas

635
00:32:48,450 --> 00:32:44,859
revealing human footprints in the same

636
00:32:51,659 --> 00:32:48,460
rock stratum with dinosaur tracks also

637
00:32:54,269 --> 00:32:51,669
have to go here though

638
00:32:56,879 --> 00:32:54,279
AIG wants to save something from the

639
00:32:59,549 --> 00:32:56,889
wreck some prominent creationist

640
00:33:02,249 --> 00:32:59,559
promoters of these tracks have long

641
00:33:04,769 --> 00:33:02,259
since withdrawn their support some of

642
00:33:07,700 --> 00:33:04,779
the allegedly human tracks may be

643
00:33:10,109 --> 00:33:07,710
artifacts of erosion of dinosaur tracks

644
00:33:12,509 --> 00:33:10,119
but they're not giving in without a

645
00:33:16,859 --> 00:33:12,519
fight however there is much evidence

646
00:33:20,669 --> 00:33:16,869
that dinosaurs and humans coexisted Arg

647
00:33:23,070 --> 00:33:20,679
now regards as officially doubtful the

648
00:33:26,549 --> 00:33:23,080
proposition that the speed of light has

649
00:33:29,239 --> 00:33:26,559
decreased over time see decay in that

650
00:33:32,249 --> 00:33:29,249
case they will also have to turf out

651
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:32,259
Andrew Snelling 'he's blatant acceptance

652
00:33:37,409 --> 00:33:34,690
of bury set of fields work in this area

653
00:33:40,469 --> 00:33:37,419
that there is still a systematic pattern

654
00:33:43,139 --> 00:33:40,479
to the radiometric dates coinciding with

655
00:33:45,359 --> 00:33:43,149
the observed sequence of rock units that

656
00:33:48,899 --> 00:33:45,369
has been explained by a set of field as

657
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:48,909
due to the decay in the speed of light

658
00:33:56,549 --> 00:33:52,450
and before we leave the february 1984

659
00:33:59,369 --> 00:33:56,559
issue does AIG still seriously maintain

660
00:34:03,330 --> 00:33:59,379
that Aboriginal Australians practice a

661
00:34:05,669 --> 00:34:03,340
large number of Jewish customs retaining

662
00:34:07,669 --> 00:34:05,679
traditions of creation Noah's Flood and

663
00:34:10,529 --> 00:34:07,679
the Tower of Babel

664
00:34:14,159 --> 00:34:10,539
perhaps this offensive argument is one

665
00:34:19,690 --> 00:34:14,169
more that they could add to their list

666
00:34:22,770 --> 00:34:19,700
collapse of canopy none of the other ex

667
00:34:25,990 --> 00:34:22,780
knee lows I looked at fared much better

668
00:34:28,869 --> 00:34:26,000
than the previous example the October

669
00:34:31,990 --> 00:34:28,879
1984 Edition featured recent dinosaur

670
00:34:35,109 --> 00:34:32,000
sightings in the Congo now presumably

671
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:35,119
related to the Paluxy status Biloxi

672
00:34:41,020 --> 00:34:37,690
itself was pushed to the limit by CSF

673
00:34:44,050 --> 00:34:41,030
luminary Ken Ham research by

674
00:34:47,079 --> 00:34:44,060
creationists such as dr. John Marsh dr.

675
00:34:49,629 --> 00:34:47,089
Clifford Wilson and dr. Carl Bao has

676
00:34:53,220 --> 00:34:49,639
established that there are human

677
00:34:57,820 --> 00:34:53,230
footprints that cannot be carvings oh

678
00:35:02,530 --> 00:34:57,830
dear not only has Paluxy gone but so has

679
00:35:06,310 --> 00:35:02,540
Koba AI G's position on Bao is that he's

680
00:35:08,470 --> 00:35:06,320
well-meaning but he unfortunately uses a

681
00:35:11,109 --> 00:35:08,480
lot of material that is not sound

682
00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:11,119
scientifically so we advise against

683
00:35:20,380 --> 00:35:15,530
relying on any evidence he produces back

684
00:35:22,660 --> 00:35:20,390
in 1984 Ken hams article burbled happily

685
00:35:25,900 --> 00:35:22,670
along telling us all about the aftermath

686
00:35:28,960 --> 00:35:25,910
of the deluge when the water canopy in

687
00:35:31,329 --> 00:35:28,970
the Bible implies existed around the

688
00:35:35,109 --> 00:35:31,339
Earth's atmosphere up to the time of

689
00:35:37,750 --> 00:35:35,119
Noah's Flood was gone sorry Ken but the

690
00:35:40,780 --> 00:35:37,760
water canopy argument has now been

691
00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:40,790
classified as doubtful hence in

692
00:35:46,900 --> 00:35:43,970
advisable to use which rather undermines

693
00:35:49,660 --> 00:35:46,910
your entire position Ham proceeded to

694
00:35:52,720 --> 00:35:49,670
identify job's Leviathan

695
00:35:55,690 --> 00:35:52,730
as having been some form of

696
00:35:59,349 --> 00:35:55,700
fire-breathing dragon and asserted that

697
00:36:00,160 --> 00:35:59,359
it could even be true that the Loch Ness

698
00:36:03,730 --> 00:36:00,170
monster

699
00:36:06,940 --> 00:36:03,740
if Nessie really exists is a variety of

700
00:36:09,579 --> 00:36:06,950
plesiosaur again the plesiosaur is

701
00:36:11,530 --> 00:36:09,589
persona non grata at the moment with the

702
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:11,540
dead one allegedly found near New

703
00:36:17,530 --> 00:36:13,970
Zealand actually the decayed carcass of

704
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:17,540
a basking shark also on AI G's hit list

705
00:36:24,339 --> 00:36:20,930
after the required excisions this issue

706
00:36:26,319 --> 00:36:24,349
of X knee low now resembles a piece of

707
00:36:28,900 --> 00:36:26,329
Swiss cheese

708
00:36:31,329 --> 00:36:28,910
perhaps we should toddle off to a

709
00:36:34,900 --> 00:36:31,339
creationist conference or two in the

710
00:36:42,939 --> 00:36:34,910
hope of discovering some infallible

711
00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:42,949
truths light relief we might skip the

712
00:36:49,239 --> 00:36:45,890
creation science weekend held it must

713
00:36:52,150 --> 00:36:49,249
fail in June 1983 sintering as it did on

714
00:36:56,130 --> 00:36:52,160
the work of Barry Satterfield now on the

715
00:36:59,559 --> 00:36:56,140
nose but then the brilliant astronomer

716
00:37:02,349 --> 00:36:59,569
physicist full-time Christian worker who

717
00:37:04,509 --> 00:37:02,359
is responsible for what is possibly the

718
00:37:08,349 --> 00:37:04,519
most sensational research discovery in

719
00:37:11,370 --> 00:37:08,359
the whole bible science field ie the

720
00:37:14,199 --> 00:37:11,380
slowing of the speed of light

721
00:37:17,259 --> 00:37:14,209
unfortunately we'll also miss a showing

722
00:37:20,489 --> 00:37:17,269
of the film footprints in the stone said

723
00:37:23,469 --> 00:37:20,499
around the Paluxy River a fast-moving

724
00:37:26,189 --> 00:37:23,479
documentary which shatters the widely

725
00:37:30,640 --> 00:37:26,199
taught geologic table of evolution

726
00:37:32,769 --> 00:37:30,650
surely we'll have better luck at the CSF

727
00:37:36,849 --> 00:37:32,779
Summer Institute held in Melbourne

728
00:37:40,839 --> 00:37:36,859
during January 1985 John McCoy shortly

729
00:37:43,319 --> 00:37:40,849
to become a CSF unperson kicked off

730
00:37:46,419 --> 00:37:43,329
proceedings by asking the question can

731
00:37:50,559 --> 00:37:46,429
science investigate the past briefly

732
00:37:54,849 --> 00:37:50,569
answered makai the answer is no perhaps

733
00:37:58,479 --> 00:37:54,859
this is an infallible truth as it does

734
00:38:00,549 --> 00:37:58,489
not appear on a IGS dump list but the

735
00:38:03,279 --> 00:38:00,559
audience may as well have gone home

736
00:38:06,219 --> 00:38:03,289
after this so replete was the conference

737
00:38:08,859 --> 00:38:06,229
with now discarded creation arguments

738
00:38:11,229 --> 00:38:08,869
Clifford Wilson banged on about Paluxy

739
00:38:14,949 --> 00:38:11,239
while Barry said a field told everyone

740
00:38:18,099 --> 00:38:14,959
about sea decay and moon dust another

741
00:38:20,229 --> 00:38:18,109
pointed to a young creation it's the

742
00:38:23,289 --> 00:38:20,239
same story with most creationist

743
00:38:26,859 --> 00:38:23,299
conference reports dating right back to

744
00:38:30,069 --> 00:38:26,869
the 1970s most of these theories are

745
00:38:32,679 --> 00:38:30,079
really more like wild surmises in which

746
00:38:35,019 --> 00:38:32,689
a momentary surprising observation is

747
00:38:37,779 --> 00:38:35,029
rapidly exaggerated out of all

748
00:38:39,470 --> 00:38:37,789
proportion to its significance audience

749
00:38:42,650 --> 00:38:39,480
at these lectures and

750
00:38:43,520 --> 00:38:42,660
seminars wasted huge amounts of time and

751
00:38:46,130 --> 00:38:43,530
money

752
00:38:53,660 --> 00:38:46,140
listening to pseudo scientific ideas

753
00:38:57,380 --> 00:38:53,670
with very brief half-lives Gish and the

754
00:39:04,099 --> 00:39:00,289
a case in point is dr. Dwayne Gish's

755
00:39:06,979 --> 00:39:04,109
lecture tour of Australia in 1975 Gish

756
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:06,989
was at that time associate director of

757
00:39:11,779 --> 00:39:09,210
the Institute for Creation Research in

758
00:39:14,620 --> 00:39:11,789
California and his visit was organized

759
00:39:19,789 --> 00:39:14,630
by the evolution protest movement a

760
00:39:22,660 --> 00:39:19,799
precursor of CSF slash AIG a key element

761
00:39:25,640 --> 00:39:22,670
of dishes argument on this and many

762
00:39:29,410 --> 00:39:25,650
subsequent occasions was the second law

763
00:39:32,180 --> 00:39:29,420
of thermodynamics dish maintains that

764
00:39:34,789 --> 00:39:32,190
evolution is less scientific than

765
00:39:38,420 --> 00:39:34,799
creation because it contradicts some of

766
00:39:41,690 --> 00:39:38,430
our best established natural laws if the

767
00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:41,700
particles to people evolution theory is

768
00:39:48,019 --> 00:39:44,970
true matter must have the inherent

769
00:39:50,779 --> 00:39:48,029
ability to self-organize into even

770
00:39:53,539 --> 00:39:50,789
higher and higher levels of complexity

771
00:39:56,180 --> 00:39:53,549
the second law of thermodynamics one of

772
00:39:59,229 --> 00:39:56,190
the basic laws of science describes just

773
00:40:02,690 --> 00:39:59,239
the opposite tendency all natural

774
00:40:05,690 --> 00:40:02,700
spontaneously occurring processes result

775
00:40:08,720 --> 00:40:05,700
in a loss of order the universal

776
00:40:11,859 --> 00:40:08,730
tendency is to go from the complex to

777
00:40:14,509 --> 00:40:11,869
the simple from order to disorder

778
00:40:17,239 --> 00:40:14,519
evolution would require just the

779
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:17,249
opposite creationist bodies elaborated

780
00:40:22,880 --> 00:40:20,130
the argument over the years so that the

781
00:40:25,849 --> 00:40:22,890
second law was postulated as having

782
00:40:29,509 --> 00:40:25,859
begun to operate when Adam and Eve fell

783
00:40:32,989 --> 00:40:29,519
from grace in Eden but guess what now

784
00:40:35,930 --> 00:40:32,999
appears on the AI G's definitely don't

785
00:40:39,829 --> 00:40:35,940
use these arguments list the second law

786
00:40:43,220 --> 00:40:39,839
of thermodynamics began at the fall this

787
00:40:46,239 --> 00:40:43,230
law says that the entropy disorder of

788
00:40:49,099 --> 00:40:46,249
the universe increases over time and

789
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:49,109
some have thought that this was the

790
00:40:56,989 --> 00:40:52,650
result of the curse of God on Adam and

791
00:40:59,599 --> 00:40:56,999
his heirs and humanity however disorder

792
00:41:03,019 --> 00:40:59,609
isn't always harmful an obvious example

793
00:41:05,749 --> 00:41:03,029
is digestion breaking down large complex

794
00:41:08,630 --> 00:41:05,759
food molecules into their simpler

795
00:41:10,759 --> 00:41:08,640
building blocks a less obvious example

796
00:41:11,260 --> 00:41:10,769
to laymen might be the Sun heating the

797
00:41:14,720 --> 00:41:11,270
earth

798
00:41:17,180 --> 00:41:14,730
finally all beneficial processes in the

799
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:17,190
world including the development of the

800
00:41:23,870 --> 00:41:20,490
embryo to adult increase the overall

801
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:23,880
disorder of the universe showing that

802
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:27,530
the second law is not inherently a curse

803
00:41:33,980 --> 00:41:31,050
this concession cuts ass wave through

804
00:41:36,500 --> 00:41:33,990
the content of innumerable creationist

805
00:41:39,070 --> 00:41:36,510
lectures and conferences although the

806
00:41:41,660 --> 00:41:39,080
above is a variant on Gish's long

807
00:41:45,110 --> 00:41:41,670
discredited argument the creation

808
00:41:47,390 --> 00:41:45,120
message has always been that a there was

809
00:41:51,410 --> 00:41:47,400
nothing good about the second law and

810
00:41:54,440 --> 00:41:51,420
that it involved inevitable decay and be

811
00:41:57,980 --> 00:41:54,450
that it's operation entirely precluded

812
00:42:00,350 --> 00:41:57,990
the process of evolution AIG supporters

813
00:42:03,010 --> 00:42:00,360
playing fundly to their pet theories a

814
00:42:06,830 --> 00:42:03,020
recent issue of creation

815
00:42:10,550 --> 00:42:06,840
refers to readers pining for their old

816
00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:10,560
moondust argument and now be howling at

817
00:42:15,260 --> 00:42:13,530
the moon for this one Gish also

818
00:42:17,630 --> 00:42:15,270
regularly claimed that transitional

819
00:42:21,560 --> 00:42:17,640
forms proposed by evolutionary theory

820
00:42:23,990 --> 00:42:21,570
were non-existent as gaps between the

821
00:42:27,110 --> 00:42:24,000
higher categories of plants and animals

822
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:27,120
are systemic this situation directly

823
00:42:32,990 --> 00:42:29,570
supported creationist theory and

824
00:42:35,150 --> 00:42:33,000
contradicted evolution AIG is now

825
00:42:38,300 --> 00:42:35,160
backing away from such claims at the

826
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:38,310
speed of light or at least a decayed

827
00:42:44,660 --> 00:42:41,010
version of it there are no transitional

828
00:42:47,120 --> 00:42:44,670
forms is now defunct since there are

829
00:42:50,810 --> 00:42:47,130
candidates even though they are highly

830
00:42:53,690 --> 00:42:50,820
dubious we should say instead while

831
00:42:55,970 --> 00:42:53,700
Darwin predicted that the fossil record

832
00:43:00,440 --> 00:42:55,980
would show numerous transitional fossils

833
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:00,450
even 140 years later all we have are a

834
00:43:06,410 --> 00:43:03,810
handful of disputed examples from an

835
00:43:09,590 --> 00:43:06,420
historical point of view and despite the

836
00:43:14,450 --> 00:43:09,600
qualifications attached to it I would

837
00:43:16,310 --> 00:43:14,460
class this as a major retreat by AIG in

838
00:43:18,440 --> 00:43:16,320
over recent years it has been most

839
00:43:20,990 --> 00:43:18,450
interesting to observe this group

840
00:43:24,529 --> 00:43:21,000
gradually incorporate the language of

841
00:43:26,269 --> 00:43:24,539
evolution into its ideology

842
00:43:29,029 --> 00:43:26,279
it may come as a surprise to some

843
00:43:31,999 --> 00:43:29,039
skeptics to learn that creationists

844
00:43:36,159 --> 00:43:32,009
accept natural selection as an important

845
00:43:38,989 --> 00:43:36,169
part of creation full frame work that

846
00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:38,999
new species have been observed to form

847
00:43:47,689 --> 00:43:43,249
and that in some situations beneficial

848
00:43:50,269 --> 00:43:47,699
mutations do occur despite the spin

849
00:43:53,870 --> 00:43:50,279
which AIG imparts to statements like

850
00:43:56,779 --> 00:43:53,880
these one wonders how much more ground

851
00:44:00,499 --> 00:43:56,789
they can yield without attracting

852
00:44:09,250 --> 00:44:00,509
charges of apostasy from sterner Souls

853
00:44:14,230 --> 00:44:12,370
since creationism is a pseudoscience it

854
00:44:18,370 --> 00:44:14,240
should come as no surprise to learn that

855
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:18,380
most of a I G's ideas are wrong however

856
00:44:23,700 --> 00:44:20,810
it is a little surprising to see the

857
00:44:26,620 --> 00:44:23,710
group carefully gathering its gaffes

858
00:44:29,230 --> 00:44:26,630
together and posting them on the

859
00:44:32,380 --> 00:44:29,240
internet writing in the unrelated field

860
00:44:36,120 --> 00:44:32,390
of Holocaust Studies Robert young Van

861
00:44:39,730 --> 00:44:36,130
Pelt has drawn attention to the Krays

862
00:44:43,150 --> 00:44:39,740
positivism of believers in the no

863
00:44:46,150 --> 00:44:43,160
Holocaust theory the assumption that the

864
00:44:48,609 --> 00:44:46,160
discovery of one little crack will bring

865
00:44:52,170 --> 00:44:48,619
the whole building down is the

866
00:44:55,810 --> 00:44:52,180
fundamental fallacy of Holocaust denial

867
00:44:57,760 --> 00:44:55,820
creationists to seek little cracks in

868
00:45:00,490 --> 00:44:57,770
the structure of evolution which

869
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:00,500
ultimately form the basis of blooper

870
00:45:06,190 --> 00:45:03,050
lists like the one I have looked at here

871
00:45:07,180 --> 00:45:06,200
still they shouldn't have to worry for

872
00:45:10,420 --> 00:45:07,190
too much longer

873
00:45:12,370 --> 00:45:10,430
arcing back to 1986 we have it on the

874
00:45:16,690 --> 00:45:12,380
authority of Professor John Rendell

875
00:45:18,490 --> 00:45:16,700
short a former chairman of CSF that it

876
00:45:20,890 --> 00:45:18,500
is now clear that on the scientific

877
00:45:24,130 --> 00:45:20,900
level the theory of the evolution is

878
00:45:26,650 --> 00:45:24,140
rapidly losing ground some non

879
00:45:31,060 --> 00:45:26,660
creationists predict that it will be

880
00:45:35,020 --> 00:45:31,070
abandoned within 20 years so that'll be

881
00:45:41,890 --> 00:45:39,040
and that was did we say that

882
00:45:45,650 --> 00:45:41,900
creationists farewell some old friends

883
00:45:48,950 --> 00:45:45,660
written by Brian Baxter and you can find

884
00:45:50,570 --> 00:45:48,960
that on page 11 of volume 23 number one

885
00:45:54,220 --> 00:45:50,580
of the skeptic the journal from

886
00:45:57,290 --> 00:45:54,230
Australian skeptics free to download at

887
00:46:07,310 --> 00:45:57,300
WWF Descamps a you

888
00:46:10,170 --> 00:46:07,320
[Music]

889
00:46:13,290 --> 00:46:10,180
the skeptic magazine the journal from

890
00:46:15,510 --> 00:46:13,300
Australian skeptics subscribe online to

891
00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:15,520
the world's second oldest skeptical

892
00:46:24,030 --> 00:46:21,010
magazine visit WWF XCOM and click the

893
00:46:28,410 --> 00:46:24,040
publication's link you can also find

894
00:46:31,560 --> 00:46:28,420
there over 30 years of back issues free

895
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:31,570
to download the skeptic magazine from

896
00:46:50,970 --> 00:46:49,090
Australian skeptics thank you for

897
00:46:54,210 --> 00:46:50,980
listening to the skeptic zone and again

898
00:46:56,670 --> 00:46:54,220
I hope to see you at those events I

899
00:46:59,900 --> 00:46:56,680
mentioned Maynard movie night on the 1st

900
00:47:03,110 --> 00:46:59,910
of October here in Sydney and glebe and

901
00:47:07,320 --> 00:47:03,120
skeptics in the pub with Trish Han on

902
00:47:10,380 --> 00:47:07,330
the first Thursday of October at the

903
00:47:12,270 --> 00:47:10,390
Occidental hotel in Sydney thank you to

904
00:47:15,150 --> 00:47:12,280
those people who keep supporting the

905
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:15,160
show via patreon and thank you to my new

906
00:47:21,360 --> 00:47:18,370
patrons in the last week or week or two

907
00:47:24,420 --> 00:47:21,370
thank you very much every bit helps to

908
00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:24,430
keep the skeptic zone running going on

909
00:47:29,790 --> 00:47:27,330
the air in your ears on the interwebs

910
00:47:32,190 --> 00:47:29,800
something like that thanks to the

911
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:32,200
generosity and continuing support of you

912
00:47:38,310 --> 00:47:36,490
people who do what's that now I'm back

913
00:47:42,450 --> 00:47:38,320
in Australia there's some weird birds

914
00:47:45,690 --> 00:47:42,460
chirping outside the window hmm it's

915
00:47:47,700 --> 00:47:45,700
thanks to the generosity of people who

916
00:47:50,700 --> 00:47:47,710
do contribute I was able to buy some

917
00:47:53,250 --> 00:47:50,710
very nice new recording equipment which

918
00:47:56,040 --> 00:47:53,260
I'll be putting to good use I hope at

919
00:47:58,200 --> 00:47:56,050
the Australian skeptics convention in

920
00:47:59,430 --> 00:47:58,210
Melbourne that's going to be an exciting

921
00:48:01,920 --> 00:47:59,440
time and I think the good people in

922
00:48:05,220 --> 00:48:01,930
Melbourne are arranging for Maine are

923
00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:05,230
denied to have a an area room for

924
00:48:09,150 --> 00:48:07,690
podcast interviews hey if you're coming

925
00:48:10,770 --> 00:48:09,160
along you might end up being interviewed

926
00:48:12,380 --> 00:48:10,780
you probably will there's a good chance

927
00:48:14,660 --> 00:48:12,390
of that actually

928
00:48:16,700 --> 00:48:14,670
but for this week this is Richard

929
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:16,710
Saunders signing off from Sydney

930
00:48:25,849 --> 00:48:23,130
Australia you've been listening to the

931
00:48:32,509 --> 00:48:25,859
skeptic zone podcast please visit our

932
00:48:35,299 --> 00:48:32,519
website at wwlp.com tax and to access

933
00:48:38,930 --> 00:48:35,309
the bat catalog of episodes going back

934
00:48:42,559 --> 00:48:38,940
to 2008 you can follow the skeptic zone

935
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:42,569
podcast on twitter at skeptic zone visit

936
00:48:45,849 --> 00:48:44,970
our facebook page or leave a review on

937
00:48:48,529 --> 00:48:45,859
itunes

938
00:48:51,920 --> 00:48:48,539
you can also support the skeptic zone

939
00:48:54,640 --> 00:48:51,930
via patreon or paypal the skeptic zone

940
00:48:57,019 --> 00:48:54,650
podcast is an independent production

941
00:48:59,150 --> 00:48:57,029
reviews and opinions expressed on the

942
00:49:01,490 --> 00:48:59,160
skeptic zone are not necessarily those

943
00:49:03,290 --> 00:49:01,500
of Australian skeptics or any other

944
00:49:13,810 --> 00:49:03,300
sceptical organisation

945
00:49:17,290 --> 00:49:15,850
hello to the afterthoughts the people

946
00:49:18,910 --> 00:49:17,300
who listened after the music haven't

947
00:49:21,580 --> 00:49:18,920
done this for a little while it's the

948
00:49:24,850 --> 00:49:21,590
old use your psychic predictive powers

949
00:49:27,010 --> 00:49:24,860
or dumb luck to guess the role of a 10

950
00:49:31,540 --> 00:49:27,020
sided die this is a nice one it's sort

951
00:49:38,680 --> 00:49:31,550
of translucent orange orange oh there's

952
00:49:39,970 --> 00:49:38,690
that bird again well whatever alright so

953
00:49:43,120 --> 00:49:39,980
for those of you haven't played before

954
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:43,130
I'm gonna roll this D 10 pin sided die

955
00:49:48,910 --> 00:49:45,890
10 times no I'm not three times three

956
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:48,920
times and see how you go see you've got

957
00:49:54,240 --> 00:49:51,650
a 1 in 1,000 chance of guessing all

958
00:49:58,180 --> 00:49:54,250
three numbers correctly give it a shake

959
00:49:59,770 --> 00:49:58,190
think of the first number from 1 to 10

960
00:50:05,190 --> 00:49:59,780
think think think have your prediction

961
00:50:09,820 --> 00:50:05,200
here it comes and the first number is 3

962
00:50:11,410 --> 00:50:09,830
where's my skeptic Zone pen write this

963
00:50:18,990 --> 00:50:11,420
down on this bit of skipped exam paper

964
00:50:28,930 --> 00:50:19,000
here 3 alright next number here it comes

965
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:28,940
5 all right 3 5 last one last number is

966
00:50:37,210 --> 00:50:33,770
Oh another 5 I wonder if people use this

967
00:50:42,160 --> 00:50:37,220
too as the basis of their um pin codes